The Power of Forgiveness

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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby Sabina » Wed Apr 14, 2010 11:29 pm

Lucky you! =0)
I also made such a decision a few times, to simply move on and forget about what happened. In my case I can't say that it was a good choice, because all it brought me was to be hurt in the same way again. The person I interacted with didn't learn anything from those previous times when I simply let them know that they hurt me, and immediately "forgave". Instead they repeated a variation of the same old.
And when something like that happens, then you'd have to be a fool to not finally learn the lesson. :)
"Whether You believe you can, or you can't, you are right."
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby mirjana » Wed Apr 14, 2010 11:42 pm

I understand. I think that we have a very important aspect of forgiveness that need to be explained.

What does it mean to be hurt?
How much we ourselves make the word "hurt" to be strong and influence us?
If somebody tells me that I am pig, or killer or something like that what I know that I am not, how then I could be hurt?
If my child would tell me that I am not a good mother, I cannot stop being mother because of that.
What is that what we can do so that words other people tell to us do not cause emotional pain?
Don't we hurt ourselves by taking such words as given, confirming their meaning with our reaction?
If we believe that nothing happens accidently, then there is a possibility that those people who hurt us are around us because they need us in order to learn their lesson. So, if such a person is somebody close to me, how can I then turn my back to such a person when maybe just with me and having me aside the person will come to certain realizations? And inevitably this always brings some lessons to me too.
Although I am not so sure, I admit, but it seems right to me somehow.
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby Sabina » Wed Apr 14, 2010 11:51 pm

Mirjana wrote:...So, if such a person is somebody close to me, how can I then turn my back to such a person when maybe just with me and having me aside the person will come to certain realizations?

Sometimes that's really easy... like when someone specifically tells you. B0)
And voila! :)
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby mirjana » Wed Apr 14, 2010 11:56 pm

B0)
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby HGolightly » Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:26 pm

HGolightly wrote:In short, “forgiveness” (for me) means to step outside of ones self and the opposing emotion that is being experienced. Basically, in any given situation, I try to separate the individual from the offense he/she has made (also mentioned in the film).

Holly, this last part confused me. What is the purpose of separating the individual from the offense?

__3__
The ultimate purpose would be to forgive the person, no matter the offense/harm done, with the underlining motivation being out of love.

The story below is an illustration that personally resonates with me in regards to "separating the individual(s) from that of the perpetrator(s) and offense". A horrific and unspeakable incident that occurred in Kitale, Kenya (a small village with less than 25 missionaries) - the day before I arrived. I was not acquainted with this couple, but was amongst many who knew them well. The shock wave of fear and sadness that reverberated from this tragic event was intense.

Could you forgive several people who brutally attacked you and left you for dead? I don't know if I would be able separate the horrors of the offense, to that of forgiving the men who had acted out their aggression onto me. I don't know! Although, it seems that this couple are in the process of doing just that. I have been following their story since day two, but have not read their book ...

ImageThe year is 2008. Late one evening in rural Kenya, a band of men break into a farm and brutally assault and rob the couple living there. The couple had recently arrived from Canada for missionary work among orphans. Near the point of death, they struggle to find medical treatment in the dark of night. Their healing is miraculous, but the greater story is their spiritual journey to healing through the power of forgiveness. This book is their story - the shock and suffering they experienced, and the joy and hope they found, told here in their own words.

John and Eloise Bergen moved to Africa in March 2008 after living in Canada and New Zealand, where they had pastored for 25 years. They also operated a small business in Western Canada before their first trip to Kenya. They wrote this book as they prepared for their return to the Kenya they have grown to love, and where they will continue to serve orphans and others in need.

Here's a couple of links for those who are interested in reading the details: It's a tad graphic and there are photos contained within their blog (fyi).

http://www.allvoices.com/s/event-899124/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5jYmMuY2Evd29ybGQvc3RvcnkvMjAwOC8wNy8xNy9rZW55YS1jb3VwbGUuaHRtbD9yZWY9cnNz
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2009/01/13/bergen-kenya.html
http://www.bergensmission.com/
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby dermot » Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:59 pm

Holly....good stuff!
separating the person from what the person does is extremely relevant and important.

I believe our true nature is to be loving and compassionate, if that is the case then anything we do or anybody else does that is negative, is not done from our fundamental nature and so we need to see and understand this and not take it too personally.

Easier said than done!

When my first wife(!) was drinking heavily she was quite volatile, i tried to teach my children to separate their Mum as they knew her - from the behaviour she exhibited whilst drinking. One of them did, the other suffered more.

For me, forgiveness frees me from the mental consequences of anothers misguided actions/comments and allows me move on.

This takes time, and does not come easily often!
d.
....the heart only whispers, be still and listen....
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby HGolightly » Sat Apr 17, 2010 7:59 pm

__5__
Hello Dermot,
Thank you! It is interesting and I full-heartedly share in your sentiment within the aforementioned. How right you are, it's "easier said, than done." I think that is really commendable you tried to teach your children to separate the behavior from that of the mother they knew. I imagine it was not easy, and too, since we all have different responses/cooping styles - I'm sorry one of your children has suffered more.

I have had really work hard in teaching myself to separate the behavior exhibited by immediate family members, that span three generations, who also suffer from alcoholism (and, then some). The verbal abuse and volatile scenarios can overshadow the process of forgiving, and believe me, I can attest to that. Similarly to you, forgiveness has the same affect for me. In addition, to feeling love and acceptance to where that person might be stuck within the limitations they are at within their own life. It's not my place to judge, but to just try to love and understand at a distance.

Holly
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby dermot » Sat Apr 17, 2010 10:03 pm

Yes Holly, problems caused by addictions etc can affect generations, some of whom come after the events take place....people carry scars forward unknowingly and pass on the terrible consequences.

Reading your comments made me wonder and consider my childhood. I just remember feeling like nothing bad could continue, that good would always triumph over adversity, that love would conquer anything in its path....and i believed naievely that it would happen before bedtime, that day.
When Bono sang 'Sunday Bloody Sunday' on the night terrible attrocities had claimed lives of those involved in a peace march in Northern Ireland, part of me (wanted) believed extremists would listen to him and throw away their guns.
How was i to know terrorists listen to country music!

It is hard not to judge, very hard at times, but i usually feel something negative within myself when i start to do so. So i try not to.
Initially when i decided to learn to forgive, i expected a change in those being forgiven, in most cases im still waiting for that change, but it makes me feel easier now that i at least have moved on.

d.
....the heart only whispers, be still and listen....
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby mirjana » Sat Apr 17, 2010 10:41 pm

dermot wrote:...
Initially when i decided to learn to forgive, i expected a change in those being forgiven, in most cases im still waiting for that change, but it makes me feel easier now that i at least have moved on.

d.


Dermot,
These are beautiful words that can only inspire those who have difficulties to move on. Connected with the stories you had told before, they have a deep sound of truth.

PS: The Little Soul and the Sun by Neale Donald Walsch is a beautiful approach to forgiveness and description for this part "separating the person from what the person does ".
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Re: The Power of Forgiveness

Postby HGolightly » Sun Apr 18, 2010 12:14 am

dermot wrote:Yes Holly, problems caused by addictions etc can affect generations, some of whom come after the events take place....people carry scars forward unknowingly and pass on the terrible consequences.

Most definitely.

Reading your comments made me wonder and consider my childhood. I just remember feeling like nothing bad could continue, that good would always triumph over adversity, that love would conquer anything in its path....and i believed naievely that it would happen before bedtime, that day. When Bono sang 'Sunday Bloody Sunday' on the night terrible attrocities had claimed lives of those involved in a peace march in Northern Ireland, part of me (wanted) believed extremists would listen to him and throw away their guns. How was i to know terrorists listen to country music!

I haven't really thought about my childhood, until you mentioned yours. I recall that feeling of unconditional love for all; along, with the ease to which I was able to forgive, as it came so natural to me - instantaneously. I am sorry for the atrocities that claimed so many lives during the peace march in N. Ireland. Country music?! Whoa ...
80|

It is hard not to judge, very hard at times, but i usually feel something negative within myself when i start to do so. So i try not to. Initially when i decided to learn to forgive, i expected a change in those being forgiven, in most cases im still waiting for that change, but it makes me feel easier now that i at least have moved on. d.

I can identify with that specific feeling you're talking about. And, I too, divert from allowing it to cloud in. In addition, I have found it really helpful to lower my expectations - almost to a point of having none (once in a while it attempts to creep in), which has definitely made it an easier process to just forgive.


[El] <3
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