That's a thought ...

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That's a thought ...

Postby Naveen » Tue Jul 06, 2010 4:08 pm

I don’t know if on your walks you have noticed a long, narrow pool beside the river. Some fishermen must have dug it, and it is not connected with the river. The river is flowing steadily, deep and wide, but the pool is heavy with scum because it is not connected with the life of the river, and there are no fish in it. It is a stagnant pool, and the deep river, full of life and vitality, flows swiftly along.

Now, don’t you think human beings are like that? They dig a little pool for themselves away from the swift current of life, and in that little pool they stagnate, die; and this stagnation, this decay we call existence. That is, we all want a state of permanency; we want certain desires to last forever, we want pleasures to have no end. We dig a little hole and barricade ourselves in it with our families, with our ambitions, our cultures, our fears, our gods, our various forms of worship, and there we die, letting life go by – that life which is impermanent, constantly changing, which is so swift, which has such enormous depths, such extraordinary vitality and beauty.

Have you not noticed that if you sit quietly on the bank of the river you hear its song – the lapping of the water, the sound of the current going by? There is always a sense of movement, an extraordinary movement towards the wider and the deeper. In the little pool, there is no movement at all; its water is stagnant ... This is what most of us want: little stagnant pools of existence away from life. We say that our pool existence is right, and we have invented a philosophy to justify it; we have developed social, political, economic, and religious theories in support of it, and we don’t want to be disturbed because what we are after is a sense of permanency.

To seek permanency means wanting that which is pleasurable to continue indefinitely, and wanting that which is not pleasurable to end as quickly as possible. We want the name that we bear to be known and to continue through family, through property. We want a sense of permanency in our relationships, in our activities, which means that we are seeking a lasting, continuous life in the stagnant pool; we don’t want any real changes there, so we have built a society which guarantees us the permanency of property, of name, of fame...

Life is like the river: endlessly moving on, ever seeking, exploring, pushing, overflowing its banks, penetrating every crevice with its water. But the mind won’t allow that to happen to itself. The mind sees that it's dangerous, risky to live in a state of impermanency, insecurity, so it builds a wall around itself ...

Religion is the feeling of goodness, that love which is like the river, living, moving everlastingly. In that state ... there is no longer any search at all, and this ending of search is the beginning of something totally different. The search for God, for truth, the feeling of being completely good – not the cultivation of goodness, of humility, but the seeking out of something beyond the inventions and tricks of the mind, which means having a feeling for that something, living in it, being it – that is true religion. But you can do that only when you leave the pool you have dug for yourself and go out into the river of life.

Excerpt from JK’s Think on These Things.
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby Sabina » Tue Jul 06, 2010 10:52 pm

Naveen,
This is beautiful, inspiring and I agree with it 100%.

Letting go of the fear, any and all fear, and accepting life as a journey with all the changes that come is not always easy, and there are plenty of excuses should anyone need one, but that is no way to live a life.
Krishnamurti's text is simple, with a nice metaphor, to remind us of a very simple and very important truth.

Thank you!

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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby mirjana » Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:54 am

Naveen, these are great words of a beautiful mind and I am thankful you put them here. It seems that you put much light on this aspect of life, as your other topic 'Even this shall pass !' expresses the same thought from another perspective. I love both these approaches and cannot say it better than Sabina has already done it. Kudos for these two contributions.
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby Naveen » Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:15 pm

Glad you liked it Sabina!

Thanks Mirjana..Thanks for underlining the need to be aware when we re blissful ...
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby ThePermster » Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:11 pm

The problem is most people don't know they've dug a pool, nor dwell in it.

I wonder if in this current point of time if it's not more important for the individual to forgo their own "pool escape" in an effort to help others get out and back into the river beforehand.

Without stretching the metaphor too far, imagine if the pool gathered it's own current and began carving a path for itself back to rejoin the river.
Personally that's how I currently commit myself, I am happy to lay down my personal existential fulfilment in an effort to raise the collective wisdom of the world, thus allowing the goal of existential fulfilment to not be a thing so rarely achieved but instead become a human-wide target that all are aware of and all strive for. I wouldn't call it a selfless thing, merely a necessary thing.
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby Ryan » Wed Jul 07, 2010 11:06 pm

ThePermster wrote:Personally that's how I currently commit myself, I am happy to lay down my personal existential fulfilment in an effort to raise the collective wisdom of the world, thus allowing the goal of existential fulfilment to not be a thing so rarely achieved but instead become a human-wide target that all are aware of and all strive for.

In my opinion, you aren't going to help anyone with your choice of presentation. Most aren't going to understand you. You don't seem to have the fundamental ability to explain anything in a manner other than that as you yourself have learned it.

I believe you may have accumulated a nice bit of knowledge but you lack experience with which you can apply that knowledge. And your approach seems almost arrogant... in which case most will turn away rather than to take you seriously as a knowledgeable source.
[R] If you don't understand something I said or why I said it... ask me.
If you don't want to understand something I said or why I said it... tell me.
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby ThePermster » Thu Jul 08, 2010 11:49 am

Oh those are just my verbal mannerisms and if I do say so myself I think in fact I've had just the right experience in order to properly apply myself. I readily admit that my dialectical persona is not a good teacher, that part of me has grown and been catered towards the academic side of my pursuits and passions.
No, I don't teach people with my voice, nor would I want to! Like I say my choice in this matter isn't selfless because I don't want to teach by choice, I just feel the world as is has forced my hand with obligation, ugh, in actuality I hate teaching, it's not me. But instead, to allow my dialectical abilities to continue helping me forward but also have a positive influence upon the collective wisdom, I simply represent iconoclasm in my lifestyle, in my behaviour and in my creative outputs, something I think more people should try to do. It's all well and good to assert an alternative lifestyle but in the end can you really live it? How many people do you know that are all talk and no action? Well I take pride in knowing that I'm not one of those people.

For instance, I think of the current structure of relationships in our society to be a very fickle thing, a part of our society where nature is still a very dominant force, people seemingly covet instead of loving, equating love to sex and vise versa, it's a travesty. And people scoff and don't even consider the alternative ideas, polygamy, polyamory just to name a couple, many people aren't even aware there's a choice.
But ask my friends and they'll all tell you they have a choice, why? Because I set the example in my personal relationships and the idea has pervaded from my lifestyle into their ideological vocabulary.
Yes this is something that we all do naturally anyway but usually we're unconscious of how the choices in our lives actually define the choices of those who surround us. I just like to be extra aware of it so that I might only cause the repercussions that I mean to.
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby Naveen » Thu Jul 08, 2010 2:28 pm

Mr. Azim Premji recently said something I found quite intriguing-

"In my youth, I thought of myself as a rebel and was, many times, a rebel without a cause. Today, I realize that my rebellion was another kind of conformity. We defied our elders to fall in line with our peers!

Ultimately, we must learn to respond instead of reacting. When we respond, we evaluate with a calm mind and do whatever is most appropriate. We are in control of our actions. When we react, we are still doing what the other person wants us to do."
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby Sabina » Thu Jul 08, 2010 2:53 pm

Naveen wrote:Ultimately, we must learn to respond instead of reacting. When we respond, we evaluate with a calm mind and do whatever is most appropriate. We are in control of our actions. When we react, we are still doing what the other person wants us to do."

That's very interesting Naveen.
What about the innocence of a child?
Does the child respond (after a calm evaluation) and does what is most appropriate, or does it react?
=0)
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Re: That's a thought ...

Postby Naveen » Thu Jul 08, 2010 3:10 pm

I think a child reacts.There does not seem to be a calm evaluation.

I am thinking if reacting is being innocent.Can I evaluate without being judgmental ?

Food for thought.My compliments Sabina :)
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