Jealousy

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Jealousy

Postby mirjana » Sat Mar 13, 2010 1:50 pm

"El Tango de Roxanne" from the movie "Moulin Rouge", soundtrack-t343.html inspired me to put this topic about jealousy.
Jealousy is considered as the negative thought or emotion that is expression of insecurity and fear of losing something and of anger because someone is "moving in on" something that we feel belongs only to us or anxiety because it anticipates loss of something. It is mostly combined of the three major emotions, anger, sadness and disgust.
It is very present in all kinds of human relationships in spite of differences in manifestation which could eventually be colored by cultural differences. As a very powerful presence in humans’ relationships it has always been a theme in literature, music, movies and all other artistic expressions. It is also a subject of many scientist researches (Psychology, sociology, Biology, Theology). Interestingly, jealousy can last much longer than the emotion which has caused it, such as anger, and not losing in intensity.
Possible approach to understand the message jealousy
False beliefs mostly underline jealousy. Beliefs that belong to such are so called general beliefs like: “All men are like…” or “All women are like…” or “All people from here/there are …”
The positive effect of this emotion is that it can alert us to what we want and what is important to us. If we are jealous about money, we may have an underlying need for security or freedom. The following questions open the way to understanding the cause of this emotion:
Why am I jealous over this? /What is making me jealous? / What am I trying to keep/Why do I feel threatened?
Understanding the reason opens the way to solve the problem without having negative emotion of jealousy.
The way how we use words can also be helpful. Instead to blame someone else, we should use words that express how we feel about something. Instead to say:”You said terrible things”, it is better to say:” I felt terrible (sad, or how you felt) when you said that”.

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Jealousy and Envy

Postby mirjana » Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:09 pm

"In jealousy there is more self-love than love."
Francois Duc de la Rochefoucauld

"Plain women are always jealous of their husbands. Beautiful women never are. They are always so occupied with being jealous of other women's husbands."
Oscar Wilde

"Do not overrate what you have received, nor envy others. He who envies others does not obtain peace of mind."
Buddha

What is the difference between jealousy and envy?
What is jealousy for you?
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Re: Jealousy

Postby Heidi » Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:03 pm

About jealousy in love.
There is a beautiful Greek song about it. It's been quite popular in our country.
I tried to translate the lyrics, but the original is always better...


My jealousy

When I get out of control
When I roll downhill fully uncontrolled
Not even God Himself can stop me

You were away, just for one single hour
There's an eclipse of the sun
And darkness has fallen all around

When I get out of control
When I roll downhill fully uncontrolled
Not even God Himself can stop me

My jealousy
You are the reason my heart is alive
Talk to me, talk to me
But go away when he comes to me
You are as strong as my love is
Talk to me, talk to me
But go away when he comes to me

I tell you lies
And cry in secret
Out of love, jealousy and selfisness
And when I'm lying
And when I'm to blame
Jealousy is the reason I have to pretend
I tell you lies
And cry in secret
Out of love, jealousy and selfisness
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Re: Jealousy

Postby Heidi » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:21 am

Jealousy can be stronger than love itself, but it can destroy a good relationship...

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Re: Jealousy

Postby mirjana » Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:33 pm

Heidi, thank you. I enjoyed so much this song. I like greek music and this is a good representative. Knowing the words you translated made it closer. Great!
This is a good approach to regard this phenomenon through verses and music.



This osng gives a nice list of emotions that are part of jealousy...
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Re: Jealousy

Postby Heidi » Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:52 pm

Very emotional, Mirjana!
We all wish John Lennon hadn't left us so early...
He still had so much to give.
=0(
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Re: Jealousy

Postby Sabina » Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:20 pm

Heidi,
Thank you for the fitting audio-visual and the translation!
Literary drama has many stories of jealousy or envy as well... and both jealousy and envy can "inspire" people to do horrendous things sometimes.

Mirjana wrote:What is the difference between jealousy and envy?
What is jealousy for you?

I remember jealousy only in theory. 80|
That's a good thing I suppose... but realizing that felt somewhat strange.
Envy I do not know. I don't think I was ever really envious of anyone. My pains were different. lol

jealousy
–noun
1. jealous resentment against a rival, a person enjoying success or advantage, etc., or against another's success or advantage itself.
2. mental uneasiness from suspicion or fear of rivalry, unfaithfulness, etc., as in love or aims.
3. vigilance in maintaining or guarding something.
envy
–noun
1. a feeling of discontent or covetousness with regard to another's advantages, success, possessions, etc.
2. an object of envious feeling: Her intelligence made her the envy of her classmates.


As for the difference between the two, this can help:
Envy and jealousy are very close in meaning. Envy denotes a longing to possess something awarded to or achieved by another: to feel envy when a friend inherits a fortune. Jealousy, on the other hand, denotes a feeling of resentment that another has gained something that one more rightfully deserves: to feel jealousy when a coworker receives a promotion. Jealousy also refers to anguish caused by fear of unfaithfulness.


Addendum
I just remembered a time when I was envious!! I was 11 years old and my 4 years older cousin had all kinds of fancy stationary, mainly from Hello Kitty, sent to her by her father who lived abroad. My stationary was functional and my parents didn't want to buy me the other stuff. They explained to me that I had a father while she only had the fancy stationary from her father, and I regretted feeling envious. I still wanted the Hello Kitty stationary, but the envy was not there anymore. There you go.
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Re: Jealousy

Postby mirjana » Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:32 pm

Thank you Sabina. You are lucky one if you cannot remember being jealous.
I have also never been envious and unfortunately I have been experienced different pain too (I understood what you mean when you said that).
As in this explanation about the two there is a rivalry that is mentioned, I also think that the emotion of rivalry somehow combines jealousy and Envy.

Famous sibling rivalry in art
Literature shows a significant number of sibling rivalries which is one of the manifestations of jealousy. By Shakespeare’s we see sisters’ rivalry is King Lear and The Taming of the Shrew and brothers’ rivalry in Richard III and as you like it.
John Steinbeck famous piece of art “East of Eden is a classic about brothers’ rivalry. And the Bible story of Kane and Abel was brilliantly shown in the serial Kane and Abel. This serial was a great example how fatal the combination of anger, hate and jealousy can be and how these three emotions are actually very connected. Another fatal example was in The Godfather with brothers Michael and Fredo Corleone.
Very interesting brother/sister rivalry was between Ross and Monica Geller in Friends
Two brothers in the same work was an example for professional brothers’ rivalry in Fraiser and Niles Crane in Fraiser.There at least this rivalry is presented in the comic way but still nicely clear as a rivalry.
One of the most famous sisters’ rivalries was between actresses Olivia de Havilland and Joan Fontaine . They had an uneasy relationship from childhood and in 1975 the sisters stopped speaking to each other completely.
What is that what pushes people so far that jealousy becomes stronger than one of the biggest loves, which is actually love between siblings? Or am I wrong?
PS: some information about siblings rivalry here: sibling-rivalry-t307.html
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Re: Jealousy

Postby earlb71 » Tue Apr 06, 2010 3:58 pm

=0/ Some thoughts:

1. "It is mostly combined of the three major emotions, anger, sadness and disgust"
Isn't fear also an emotion?

2. "What is the difference between jealousy and envy?"
Can one be jealous without envy - in other words, does envy lead to jealousy so that jealousy = envy + want

3. Is jealousy always bad? Or is the degree of jealousy that is wrong?

more questions, and no answers...
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Re: Jealousy

Postby mirjana » Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:17 pm

earlb71 wrote:=0/ Some thoughts:

1. "It is mostly combined of the three major emotions, anger, sadness and disgust"
Isn't fear also an emotion?

It is, you are right. =0)
earlb71 wrote:2. "What is the difference between jealousy and envy?"
Can one be jealous without envy - in other words, does envy lead to jealousy so that jealousy = envy + want

I think it can. It is well explained in Sabina’s answer above, where in quotes there is a comparison between envy and jealousy.
earlb71 wrote:3. Is jealousy always bad? Or is the degree of jealousy that is wrong?

more questions, and no answers...

I think that no emotions are bad if they are within tolerable limits. When the jealousy is based on imagination and based only on fear which is not based on real facts, then it is a damaging degree. If it is based on some events or previous experiences, then it could eventually have a protective role.
You are right, more questions than answers. It would be nice to hear some of yours.

Welcome to DS, earlb71 =0)
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