Is it wrong to ask ?

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Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby ubermensch » Fri Nov 11, 2011 4:13 pm

So I was doing some searching online about a few spiritual authors the other day and ran across a video of Jonathan Bowden (some political person from england) . Anyway, he was ranting about a multicultural movement. Apparently they are bringing in people from very different cultures races and backgrounds , giving them free housing , free education and then turning and blaming the middle class for the massive debt they have accumulated .
Needless to say I was blown away . The exact thing is happening here in the U.S. . This is obviously no coincidence , we leave our borders barely guarded then debate for decades on what we should do , all the while giving out free college educations ( california dream act ) and citizenship to those that are most fleet of foot to scale our 12 foot high chain link fences ( I assume they are in place to ensure they are physically fit to work here ). Now , Im most definitely not complaining about the latino's desire to come to the U.S. and I'm not so small minded as to practice racism against them . I see the real problem , our politicians or the invisible hand that seems to guide them not only here in the U.S. but apparently abroad as well . It almost seems like its a movement against white people in general . ( I have to pause here and reiterate that I'm not a racist , well maybe I am a racist to the extent that I would like to save my own, and if this site is as advertised "The quest for Truth" then this question will not be dismissed with the normal disregard it gets here in the U.S..... and yes I have to confront the egotistical side of the psyche b/c I feel the mind with which you may use to answer this question is polluted with other forms of propaganda that has allowed this situation to get as far as it has ) Shouldn't we be able to approach this subject with out the guilt it seems like we have been saddled with over the years , Europeans with WW2 , American/Europeans with slavery ? I can feel a part of me that is nervous about even bringing this up. Like I did at 12 years old when I approached a girl I wasnt sure I was worthy of approaching. But fears like that have to be shrugged off , dont they ? I have to ask myself and you . Are we worthy of approaching this daunting question ? Is this the destiny of the european , to either be bred out of existence or our numbers made so small that we become a minority in the countries which our ancestors died trying to build ? Or are we supposed to sit back and not ask at all =0X and be happy with our ability to pause, rewind and fast forward live tv (which I feel is a tool to make us feel as though we are in control, being that most people who have this feature are middle class, and being that you are fast forwarding through the commercials that are designed for the exact people you gave the ability to skip through them. This makes no sense from a business view point ... Unless of course all the companies that pay for advertising are so consolidated that they dont care who you buy from being that most are owned by only a few bigger corporations anyway) , play on the computer and ask real questions that deliver digital results, which dont translate well to reality.... Surely I'm not the only one who feels the pull of subliminal tools that keep people sidetracked from asking and answering real questions .....WOW ... as you can tell by this disjointed rant 80S , I am trying to process a large amount of information , so I ask again ....Are we worthy of approaching this daunting question ? Is this the destiny of the european , to either be bred out of existence, or our numbers made so small that we become a minority in the countries which our ancestors died trying to build ?
The more I give to consciousness/awareness , the more consciousness gives to me . .... ....
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby Ryan » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:17 pm

Well sir, in my honest opinion, I believe that all borders should be removed. I believe the faster we come to grips with the fact that there isn't any "them" and that there is only "us" (which doesn't exclude any living thing) the better everything will be for all of us.

You ask about whether or not we can pull ourselves away from the embedded fear of appearing racist... well let's carry that a bit further and ask the question of whether or not we can pull ourselves away from the belief that we (this group of humans or that group of humans) own any part of this world or its resources? Why is it that education is a commodity and who does it benefit to make it so? I think the approach is wrong and the debt you mention is inevitable simply on the fact that the system does not work. But by pointing the blame at this group or that group within the middle or lower classes only preoccupies those classes from putting their attention on the real problem.
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby Sabina » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:20 pm

I would like to contribute the following video to the conversation. It's only 5 minutes long, please watch all of it, incl. the solution to the problem.



(From "Bulworth" with Warren Beatty and Halle Berry)


PS: Happy Birthday ubermensch!
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby Ryan » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:29 pm

... sorry, I missed to see and say it the first time...


__10__
For turning 36.
Happy Birthday!!

__5__
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby ubermensch » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:09 am

Good points ... And you are right ... After a trip to the mall this afternoon and seeing all these different cultures all with something to offer but unable to due to ideas like the one I was entertaining. Sometimes I tend to go over board on certain subjects and immersing myself like that seems to allow me to feel the persons plight ... so after 4 to 5 hours of video, recordings and a couple hours of reading I began to not necessarily identify with this , but began to feel not only his loss but feel his sense of urgency almost as my own. Its a funny thing , you dont really feel the mind closing , but feel it opening to something new. Even if that something new requires other parts to close ... Thanks for the feedback .
The more I give to consciousness/awareness , the more consciousness gives to me . .... ....
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby ubermensch » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:11 am

thanks for that too ...
The more I give to consciousness/awareness , the more consciousness gives to me . .... ....
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby mirjana » Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:05 pm

Hi ubermensch,

I like how you took Sabina's and Ryan's answers. =0)

Sabina & Ryan,
I admire your answers. <3
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby Ryan » Mon Nov 14, 2011 3:34 pm

Well Ubermensch, we all have our moments where we are irritated because of something to which we have been subjected. A lot of my moments happen in the grocery store where people tend to behave like they are the only person walking the aisles. But I am getting better and better at where to place the blame and through that, instead of focusing anger towards that person or the actual cause to why that person is the way they are, I switch to focus a more positive outlook to the future when all people will behave in a more considerate and compassionate manner towards all things and to myself as to how to make things so.

Mirjana, glad you liked the answers.
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby dermot » Thu Nov 17, 2011 11:51 pm

A brave question Ubermensch, and nicely dealt with by Sabina and Ryan.

I felt uncomfortable reading it, part of me wondered if it was the subject matter or something else. For me this whole area represents what happens when attention is focused outward too much, there is huge potential for imaginings, prejudices, misunderstandings, and the basis for all this is simple Fear.
There are two things....Love and Fear (Anthony de Mello), and attention directs which way we go. If we focus outward continually we experience Fear eventually. If we turn attention inward you find Love, and if you find it within....you see it without. The danger is in not remembering to look within.
Sometimes things arise and we feel we only have two options, we have to either agree or disagree, but often the answer is that we dont need to enter the circus in the first place.

I think we need to resist the urge to be engaged all the time, and learn to let go, finding Truth within is so easy...if we remember to look there!

d.
....the heart only whispers, be still and listen....
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Re: Is it wrong to ask ?

Postby mirjana » Fri Nov 18, 2011 2:11 am

dermot wrote:A brave question Ubermensch, and nicely dealt with by Sabina and Ryan.

I felt uncomfortable reading it, part of me wondered if it was the subject matter or something else. For me this whole area represents what happens when attention is focused outward too much, there is huge potential for imaginings, prejudices, misunderstandings, and the basis for all this is simple Fear.
There are two things....Love and Fear (Anthony de Mello), and attention directs which way we go. If we focus outward continually we experience Fear eventually. If we turn attention inward you find Love, and if you find it within....you see it without. The danger is in not remembering to look within.
Sometimes things arise and we feel we only have two options, we have to either agree or disagree, but often the answer is that we dont need to enter the circus in the first place.

I think we need to resist the urge to be engaged all the time, and learn to let go, finding Truth within is so easy...if we remember to look there!

d.


Dear Dermot,
I just love every word of your answer. [Pd]
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