Defining Wisdom

Metaphysical, spiritual, philosophical or mystical topics.
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby GenerousGeorge » Fri Jan 15, 2010 7:36 am

I agree Sabina.....there seem to be several schools of thoughts on that. Many believe their God is the source of our knowledge of good and evil. That without his oniscient guidance, we are all worthless sinners deserving of an eternity of torture in the kinda, very warm place somewhere below us.

Another school of thought is that this instinct is the result of evolution and those with the best instinct for working together with their human fellows, were best equippwd to survive and able to reproduce those successful genes.

I lean toward the idea that our human bdies, i.e. in particular our brain are more holographic communication mechanisms for God/Higher Power/Whatever than generators of thought and we are all reflections of God and are in constant communication with that power which includes the knowledge of good and evil.
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby mirjana » Fri Jan 15, 2010 1:55 pm

GenerousGeorge wrote:...

I lean toward the idea that our human bdies, i.e. in particular our brain are more holographic communication mechanisms for God/Higher Power/Whatever than generators of thought and we are all reflections of God and are in constant communication with that power which includes the knowledge of good and evil.


This is closest to my understanding. Drop is the part of the ocean, but the ocean also reflects in one drop. I see us as drops of the whole, but in each and every drop there is the reflection of that whole, however we call it, God/Higher Power/Source.
Instinct, inspiration, visualization, dreams...are a kind of generators. As much we are able to silent our attachments to the physical existence of this reality, I think we are more able to penetrate over these generators into the eternal source of all ideas.
We wouldn´t have an idea of evil if it weren´t be there too. I can imagine that such omnipotent force knows why it is needed to be there too. I understand it as a tool for learning about experiences, and experiences are cells of life...something like that.

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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby Alvino » Fri Jan 15, 2010 7:10 pm

My insight about the essence of wisdom is this:
it is the ability to connect known knowledge to a Similar new possible harmful to Myself or harmful to others situation and then Creating
new knowledge to decide what your next step will be.

example, I burned my hand on a hot wood fire. Later I see a gas fire and
although no wood is present I make the decision that this will burn me , also.
Of course the answer to what is wisdom will require many more traits
attached to human wisdom
added. Using my favorite example of what wisdom is , it will follow that God
can never be wise because God has always been the owner of ALL knowledge.
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby Sabina » Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:00 pm

Wisdom as something that is acquired with age and experiences makes sense. It is not by chance that one of the classic images of a wise person is an old sage. People rarely refer to children, teenagers or young adults as wise, and if they do, then they are usually called an "old soul".

Now connecting Alvino's final statement that God can never be wise, as God doesn't acquire knowledge, God already knows it all, with the statement of Generous George (a few posts up), that we are all reflections of God, the outcome is that we cannot be wise either. We, as reflections of God, already know it all, just as God (a.k.a. supreme being, etc. etc. *insert your special title here*) does. We just don't know that we know it.

Does anyone agree with that?
Let's assume for the moment that it is true.
Then the question would be - why don't we know that we know it all?
Why don't we (or most people) have an awareness of our omniscience and omnipotence?

Sabina

PS: Alvino, welcome to Deep Spirits!
"Whether You believe you can, or you can't, you are right."
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby GenerousGeorge » Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:54 pm

The problem is our definititon of omnipotence, perfect etc. Perfect could mean the best we have so far and perfect within our reality. There is some chance that the purpose of the whole/God/Higher power is a journey similar to what we are on, but with parameters and goals that we are incapable of recognizing.

I like the idea that the challenges of existence in our reality are the only way to continue the process to meet the (not yet understandable) goals of God. Trying to decide what those goals are from reading an old book written by Bronze Age Natives and then cherry picking the good stuff does not seem like the way to make progress.

That's why we need faith that there is a Higher Power that does understand the challenge and we are working in concert with that by overcoming the challenges, mental, physical and spiritual of our reality. That is the only thing that makes sense to me when I look at the overall suffering of the human race in general. We cannot understand that (Haiti for example) but we still have to get up every morning, do our best to make progress in the process and have faith (hope) that someone is "driving the bus".

There is no guarantee that any of my speculation is remotely true, so for me that means make the most of each moment which is all we are really sure of. Probably another subject, but the idea that time is illusional and used by God to give value and meaning to life fits in the equation somewhere.
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby Alvino » Fri Jan 15, 2010 9:03 pm

Friends, I think it was Socrates who picked out a young man-
say 15 years old after he said that WE HUMANS know many things
that we do not know. He asked this boy many questions about
geometry which the boy had never studied. And the boy
was able to answer all of Soc's questions.
OF course the Socratic Method is LOTS of hinting
but he proven we all know MANY THINGS THAT WE DO not
know we know.
I am grateful for the KUDO and Welcomes. thanks
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby mirjana » Sat Jan 16, 2010 2:39 am

Alvino:
„…it will follow that God
can never be wise because God has always been the owner of ALL knowledge.“

Sabina:
„Then the question would be - why don't we know that we know it all?
Why don't we (or most people) have an awareness of our omniscience and omnipotence?“

GenerousGeorge:
„There is some chance that the purpose of the whole/God/Higher power is a journey similar to what we are on, but with parameters and goals that we are incapable of recognizing.“
„I like the idea that the challenges of existence in our reality are the only way to continue the process to meet the (not yet understandable) goals of God.“
„We cannot understand that (Haiti for example) but we still have to get up every morning, do our best to make progress in the process and have faith (hope) that someone is "driving the bus".

There is no guarantee that any of my speculation is remotely true, so for me that means make the most of each moment which is all we are really sure of. Probably another subject, but the idea that time is illusional and used by God to give value and meaning to life fits in the equation somewhere.“

Alvino:
„…we all know MANY THINGS THAT WE DO not know we know.“


Hi,
I have been enjoying this beautiful talk and the way one participant inspires the next and the whole energy evolving around this topic. Nothing more to say, except, thank you for these beautiful thoughts.

Mirjana
PS: Welcome to DS, Alvino!
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby Sabina » Sat Jan 16, 2010 3:21 am

I love how this discussion is developing....

GenerousGeorge wrote:The problem is our definition of omnipotence, perfect etc. Perfect could mean the best we have so far and perfect within our reality. There is some chance that the purpose of the whole/God/Higher power is a journey similar to what we are on, but with parameters and goals that we are incapable of recognizing.


I agree. Trying to define anything that we, by our own definitions, consider infinite and intangible is a contradiction in itself. Additionally, letting our imagination run wild can be potentially harmful, in the sense of posing expectations.
Let's take stories as an example, any kind of story, be it a fairy tale, a myth, a comic book, a movie, etc.
We can and should learn from them (the good ones anyway), but some tales are so tall that rather than becoming inspiration (which is what they should be), to some people they instead become an illustration for their own limitation. They think "The story hero can do this and that, and I cannot."
In that sense they define the character as perfect and themselves, by comparison, as imperfect.
I agree that this defining of what "perfect" means, can cause problems, but only if done as a limitation.
Nothing should be a limitation.
Instead, everything should be an inspiration.
Succeeding in that attitude, in that approach to life, is a form of wisdom in my opinion.

Alvino,
Socrates was a great man who thought that he would do the biggest service to humanity by talking with people, challenging their views. Kind of like what we do here as well.
;0)
We are here to enrich ourselves and each other.
Sabina

PS: Time and the perception of time would definitely be a nice subject as well.
"Whether You believe you can, or you can't, you are right."
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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby mirjana » Sat Jan 16, 2010 1:11 pm

Alvino wrote:... God
can never be wise because God has always been the owner of ALL knowledge.


Hi Alvino,
If this phrase is originally yours it would be nice to post it for Deep Spirits quotes.

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Re: Defining Wisdom

Postby GenerousGeorge » Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:41 pm

Sabina said.... "We can and should learn from them (the good ones anyway), but some tales are so tall that rather than becoming inspiration (which is what they should be), to some people they instead become an illustration for their own limitation. They think "The story hero can do this and that, and I cannot."

Unfortunately the wildest tales and most harmful (to society) is religion that says we cannot aspire to be as good as the "story hero" and can only overcome our innate badness by believing and practicing truths based on wildly improbable tales accepted as "Gospel".
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