An Accidental Community

Exercise your mind through 'what if' scenarios, moral
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby dermot » Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:40 am

I didn't intend to sound fatalistic, the ultimate existence here is only denied by a less than rigorous honesty.

That is achievable, without striving, by simply choosing it as a way to live.

I'm not even going to argue against its possibility, because I seek its existence.
The 'oh well', pity' comment was sincere regret at failure to date rather than ingrained pessimism.

As for the 'incident', yes it was wonderfully positive and affirming to have George and Ryan sift through the words to find their truth. Magical.

Sadly, and this is just that, we have no influence over how anybody is likely to react to a different dynamic. Personal vigilance is necessary if balance is to remain within ourselves, and each other.

Passion, Beauty, Truth, they are all worth belief.
D
....the heart only whispers, be still and listen....
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby mirjana » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:00 am

Dermot, I think that comparing DS and such community was not bad idea. Or each of us can look in our lives, family and friends communities. There have been moments when we would just decide that the best is to leave some community and by that the community would not be the same any more. And people do that permanently not ready to give up their personal worlds and truths, beliefs and justice for anything or anybody.So, if such things are not possible within closer related people, then it is not easier to make it with people who would be together by chance.
Sabina, I think that further develop of DS will be a very nice proof if such community is possible. If it turns it were, what I believe is possible what depends only on us, then everything else is possible too.
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby HGolightly » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:46 am

Ta DA! The "Mingler" is here!! Lols ... The backdrop is gorgeous, the first thing that came to mind was a movie I saw years ago called, "LORD OF THE FLIES". Hm-mm, or was it "LORD OF THE RINGS"?! In any event, it should have been "LORD HELP ME" ... Lols ... Okay, I'll be quasi-serious ... feeling a little goof-a-fied :)). I read somewhere that we were running at different speeds. Hallelujah to that, as I can barely move to my own beat, let alone others ;) ... okay, okay ... I'll stop!! Only for a bit ;)

"Imagine we all find ourselves on a large, rich, but deserted island. No people, no rules, except for us...There is fresh water on the island, and some wild life."


What would be the challenges of this situation?
Adjusting from city life to that of becoming an islander. That members of this community will have a significant other, and well, ya know everyone needs a special someone ;). Since I'd like to be a part of a community, I'd petition the group to act as our community relations officer to oversee and aid in peacekeeping amongst our potentially expanding community. Issues would undoubtedly arise; however, there is always a solution to every problem. All other challenges associated with the basics of shelter, food, fire, etc. would not be an issue, because we would be working as a "team".

Can you imagine money being needed under such circumstances?
Not initially, but if it was an issue ... there is the good ole' barter system. "I'll trade my coconuts for your pet monkey." I'd like to think that a form of payment wouldn't be required, but as history has dictated in the past. If community members propagate, or separate, there is always the potential for people to have something they want or vice versa, so that's where the barter system might present itself.

What is different between that life and the life we currently live?
Whoa, pure isolation in comparison to city life. Smaller community based. People would actually know me, and I'd have to deal with conflict. Life of convenience would be altered, but in a good sense. Alternatively, it would be peaceful in contrast to the varied stimuli associated with noise pollution. Quality of air would be clean. And, lots of sunshine compared to overcast weather. Fresh water, organic food, and just overall sustainable living. Getting back to the grassroots of life, which is the polar opposite to how I, or some of us are accustomed to living. Community life would be a nice change of pace too.

What difficulties, if any, do you foresee in this environment and situation?
Perhaps, one or a few of us might not be adjusting to our new environment very well. Those who are, might need to be patient and loving to the ones who are struggling. We're a community (in my mind), so we'd need to be mindful with encouraging others who are struggling. I don't see the environment being as much of a challenge as that of the people. Conflict resolution would be inherent; especially, if we were striving to establish a symbiotic relationship within our new and unaccustomed environment. Well, there is also the unexpected dangers associated with the type of animals or creatures that we are sharing the island with. So, I don't have an answer for that - unless, we have an "animal whisperer" amongst our group. Hurricanes and tsunamis might be something we'd have to contend with too. And, as a back up plan, we could always keep a "Wilson" on staff for the downer days ;).

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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby Daywhite » Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:28 pm

I read through all the other comments on this, but rather than bounce back and forth, "Did so-and-so say this? Am I repeating something?" I'll simply toss my thoughts on canvas (er, computer screen), and go from there.

This type of utopia has been attempted often through the ages, sometimes working reasonably well, other times, a total disaster. The major recurring themes I noticed in all, those that went well as well as those that didn't, were expectations and adaptability.

Could this work? Yes, I fully believe it could. But maybe not exactly as you had planned or hoped. It would depend, I think, on how narrow your vision of utopia is. If you have certain things written in stone, those things are subject to shatter the entire community. Yes, there are obvious things: no murders, if you please, things along those lines. But even to state as a rule, Respect Each Other's Privacy, is leaving itself open to debate and individual definition.

I don't think nature would present any challenges tougher than those we may present ourselves with. If nature comes along with a huge storm, you accept, "Hey, it's nature; nothing we can do but adapt, do our best." However, with another individual, we would have certain expectations, expectations that may lead to questions like, "How could you do that?" or maybe, "What were you thinking?" We adapt to nature, but we expect others to adapt to us. We treat nature as we might a child, "Oh, she can't help it; she's just a child." But with other adults, we have expectations, definitions of things. One defines perfection one way, while the person sitting next to them will define it quite differently.

I guess to put it simply, for me, I would actually enjoy it, the getting away, isolation from modernity. I would miss family, but, generally, as long as I know they're okay and need nothing from me, I don't feel the need to see them. I would see the experience, the community, as a success, if everyone came out of it with no real harm, no tragic deaths, war breaking out among cliques, that type thing. Point being, my definition of it being a success is very broad. I would think, I did some exploring, made some great friends, and feel I'm coming out of it better than when I started, having grown in some way.

Now someone else, having the exact same experience, may come out of it seeing it as a total failure. There may have been particular things they wanted to do, the bar of expectations set high. It's kind of like an old Calvin and Hobbes strip. Calvin and Hobbes are talking and Calvin is telling Hobbes all of the things he would have if he could have anything in the world. He mentions jewels, money, all kinds of things that many long for. After he finishes, he asks Hobbes what he would want if he could have anything. Hobbes thinks for a second, and replies, "A sandwich." Calvin, completely aghast, looks at him, before telling Hobbes, "You have no imagination." In the last panel, it shows Hobbes holding a sandwich. As he starts to take a bite, Hobbes replies, "I got what I wanted."

I'm not saying we should limit our imagination to just a sandwich, but simply if you long for the jewels and all the things a mind can imagine, be prepared to wait a while. A baby falls many times while learning to walk. If you learn from each fall and get up one more time than you fall, it can work.
"Sometimes you do it to save your own life, not anybody else's. That's mostly why I write. I'm not trying to change anybody else's life or the world; I'm trying to keep from blowing my own brains out. That's the real point." -- Guy Clark
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby Sabina » Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:54 pm

Daywhite wrote:....If nature comes along with a huge storm, you accept, "Hey, it's nature; nothing we can do but adapt, do our best." However, with another individual, we would have certain expectations, expectations that may lead to questions like, "How could you do that?" or maybe, "What were you thinking?" We adapt to nature, but we expect others to adapt to us. We treat nature as we might a child, "Oh, she can't help it; she's just a child." But with other adults, we have expectations, definitions of things. One defines perfection one way, while the person sitting next to them will define it quite differently....

This is interesting... no, fascinating actually.
First of all, I am fully aware of the danger that comes from expectations, and try to not have any when it comes to other people, for the most part. I say "I try" because I am not always equally successful.. it depends on who it is. My partner, for instance, is completely excluded from this, because from him I definitely have expectations and he is aware of those. Just as I have expectations of myself.

But still... they way you put it above puts all of it into a new perspective yet again. And it brought a smile to my face.

The problem, as I see it, with that approach is that if we have no expectations of others, none at all, then thoughts like your "Think before you Blink" would mean what exactly? Because in it you write about your expectations of people... you expect them to think and use their minds, do you not?
Or you could say, you don't expect them to, you just hope they do it, but the two are closely related and quite intertwined.
"Whether You believe you can, or you can't, you are right."
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby Daywhite » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:01 pm

Always happy to bring a smile to your face <3

I didn't mean to say have no expectations at all, but more to be careful of those expectations. Say we're on the island and we come in from swimming to find someone has left our food supply unwrapped/unguarded, whatever, and an animal, other than man, has taken it. We would be pissed because it would seem the person used no common sense. I could tell whomever was responsible, I don't expect you to like everything I say, how I swim, where I camp, how I part my hair, etc., etc., but I do expect you to use a bit of common sense.

However, this brings us to the question of who chooses who goes on the island. I know who I would want on it, but, as I've told my brother, regarding common sense, common sense just ain't that common.
"Sometimes you do it to save your own life, not anybody else's. That's mostly why I write. I'm not trying to change anybody else's life or the world; I'm trying to keep from blowing my own brains out. That's the real point." -- Guy Clark
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby Sabina » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:40 pm

We had a topic about common sense not being common at all, and yes, such simple things can spoil the fun, at least for the moment.

On the other hand... imagine how relaxed we would all be... wouldn't we?
Isn't that also a pretty ideal environment to be your best self?
Yes, I know... we should always be our best selves, but I can imagine the level of relaxation playing a role in people's immediate spontaneous reactions to any problem that may come up.
"Whether You believe you can, or you can't, you are right."
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby Ryan » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:48 pm

Hmmm... I understand the situation you have presented and I agree it is a possibility... and an initial reaction to something, be it one way or another, is always possible and will certainly vary depending on personality. However, if I truly try and put myself into that situation it would probably be pretty evident from the beginning that certain members would have less of an understanding of a "natural way of life" and the others would have to expect certain things are not "common knowledge" or a matter of common sense.

I can understand that if it was a repeated offense that it could become quite annoying... especially to those who gather the food... not to mention there would soon be a problem with critters... and I think the seriousness of the matter would become more evident to the repeated offender(s) and therefore they would probably correct it themselves.

On a positive note: the "wasted" food would in actuality act as a kind of "chumming" in which the predator would soon become the wasted food's replacement. (as long as it was of equal size and of decent taste)
=0/
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby Daywhite » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:59 pm

Also, Ryan, there's the culling the herd aspect. Obviously, many will be less adept at survival, but may have other things to offer as far as helping the community. But, with the ones who simply seem clueless and refuse to learn, I'm not saying kill them, but simply stop watching out for them. Stop telling them to be careful when going out at night; maybe encourage them to go out at night. Don't stop them from eating the fruit you know to be poisonous. I know we would each have our limitations and need help; I'm not talking about that type situation. This is simply with the ones everyone agrees has become more danger than asset. If they choose to go off on their own, away from the group, fine, we wish you the best. If they choose to stay, hey, sharks gotta eat, too.
"Sometimes you do it to save your own life, not anybody else's. That's mostly why I write. I'm not trying to change anybody else's life or the world; I'm trying to keep from blowing my own brains out. That's the real point." -- Guy Clark
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Re: An Accidental Community

Postby Ryan » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:11 pm

=0@ =0@
I don't really know what to say without sticking my own neck in the noose as well... but I like the way you think!

As long as you can't say you didn't "try", right?
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